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DITW 14-11: Odyssey 6

🕑 Added 2024-04-24 19:45:15 +0000 UTC

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JL23

I’ve been wondering the same thing, does she really want to confirm who the father is. If it means keeping Josh, I think she would, but I also agree, the scenario she painted for Devlin turns her on so much, and not just because she sees this as getting the ultimate trick over on Devlin. Not confirming would allow her to control both Josh and Devlin, and that’s probably her ultimate turn on.

Bill F Protagoras

Great L_S, Excellently subversive... humour taken seriously. Can't wait for the second season of Fallout! Or KT's next turn of the screw!

L_S87

You know, i was thinking about this and I kind of wonder if she will never get a test done because she doesn't want to know. She would prefer if Josh were the father, but... *knowing* that takes away the possibility of it being Devlin's. That means no more wicked "what if" thoughts when she's feeling especially dark. She craves those moments. That said, IF Josh is in the hospital, that could be a pivotal moment for Kimmy and their relationship. Josh being at the lake still, and she rolls up and he looks fine... it comes across as a scare. Maybe even staged, to her. He's fine. No need to worry or change. Push forward. But, she walks into a hospital, Josh is in a bed hooked up to machines? That will feel very real. She didn't almost "lose" him maritally as she's been fretting over, no, she almost lost him completely, full stop. Kimmy can be vain and ignorant, but I can't imagine any scenario where that doesn't have a profound impact on how she treats Josh and their relationship moving forward. Would that be enough for Josh? Only he (and KT) knows.

Bill F Protagoras

…And there he tooke their tongues away, Their legs or else their sight. And thus Sir John in each respect So paid them all their hire, That some lay sleeping by the way Some tumbling in the mire. Some lay groning by the wals, Some in the streets downe right, The best of them did scarely know What they had done ore-night. from John Barleycorn Must Die

Bill F Protagoras

Doubt it... though it would be a significant breakthrough for her... and/or pile Pelion on Ossa for Josh's humiliation... and break his stupid heart.

Andrew Mellein

I wonder when Kimmy visits Josh in the hospital she can get that elusive paternity test done!

Bill F Protagoras

Well, KT looks as if the Odyssey has joined hands with that other classic the 'Anabasis.' Will they ever make it home?

Bill F Protagoras

Just to vent my spleen I see my friend Devlin is back on the road to virtuous martyrdom... If I leave Patreon it will be because of the American Dream... as my old friend Merlin succinctly put it... a nightmare for others! Bloody ghostly paradigm it ruined Citizen Kane! But "Mank" that's a brilliant codex!

Bill F Protagoras

At some point you wake up... and there's a storm in your teacup!

Bill F Protagoras

The fewer juicy details, the greater the feeding frenzy.

Bill F Protagoras

If you're not careful life becomes a cliché.

Bill F Protagoras

Oh, and Stone Sr will be wearing a fleeting rictus grin before his visage returns to passive predator mode... rubbing of the hands will be optional.

Bill F Protagoras

I am a cynic... but I suspect that the majority of people, who don't really know Josh and Kimmy will take this drunken confession of a virtual stranger to heap their own prejudices on these vicarious representatives of humanity. They will become part of a crude Punch and Judy show for some and a Morality play for others. To the Waters' advantage they will only be a sideshow to the worst gossip mongers who will treat them as tawdry punch bags... On the other hand, Kimmy and Josh will probably take the vitriol, condemnation and scandal that is vomited forth personally. Some people, a minority, will put on game faces and roll up their sleeves and attempt to ameliorate the shit storm of humiliation that will seem to confirm that hell is other people. In hard times they will hopefully discover who their real friends are. Josh is going to find that in vino veritas is a horrible misconception and very few people really enjoy humiliation and its BFF... shame. Kinder, well-intentioned, souls will point out it's darkest before the dawn... Kimmy will find out that the hole she is hiding from herself in is nowhere deep enough. And all sorts of unwelcome vermin will crawl out of the woodwork... but nothing is all bad... or so, the ubiquitous, THEY say! But first and foremost the estranged Waters will encounter pernicious home truths both individually, and together as the infamous couple they will have become in the eyes of that trio of Christmas ghosts... "public opinion". Aaaaah... and there's always the world wide web.

JL23

Honestly, it's such a complicated web of feelings and actions, and reactions to those actions, I'm not sure how he could even spill it all accurately. The way Josh would probably explain it includes his feeling he was misled and manipulated into wanting it from the start. So it probably just leads to them taking his side and still being mostly angry at Kimmy. Whether they'd pity him? We don't really know enough about any of them to really know. My guess is they'd just be more confused than anything else and probably ask a lot of follow ups.

Pete

If Josh did indeed spill it all without sugarcoating any of it, then I wonder what paths that could lead to? For example... 1. Are his friends too ashamed of him to even look him in the eye? 2. Or does one or more confront him? 3. Does anyone feel lied to? ("You portrayed Kimmy as awful, all this time, when in fact...")

JL23

Well, from what we're learning, seems like Kimmy's betrayal probably happens anyway. But there is still so much more we don't know about what happened at Tiffany's. Not sure we'll ever get that full picture, as I'm not sure who is the reliable narrator of it. It's honestly probably Devlin, but we've never gotten anything from his POV.

JL23

Yeah, that probably plays a role in it too. I guess I seized on her use of the term "responsibility" when it came to Josh. That to me sounded like her saying if she can prove Josh is the father, he'll feel responsibility to the child, and it will also color everything else she's done in a more positive light. Yes, I betrayed and lied, but I helped make you a father too. Whether that's true, and whether she wants to convince Josh through proof or through manipulation, is another story.

Andrew Mellein

If Josh didn’t get stone cold drunk! I think this story wouldn’t take place. Kimmy needed to have that spark without him to be bad!

Andrew Mellein

Is Josh a traditional KT cuck? Unlike other characters such as Pete and Max. Josh has held out for the most part. Is it because it was full on cheating and with his bully. Probably! But I like Josh out of all KTs husband characters. I think maybe he would have went into that angle more if it was someone other than his bully and there was no cheating and lying by Kimmy involved!

Glaucon

Personally I took it to refer to whether or not her manipulations of the Stones/financial crimes work out, ie. worst: prison, best: Kimmy in control of everyone. But it could also be an aggregate wish about everything: that, whether or not Josh leaves, whether any of her spinning plates come crashing down, etc.

RCH

Not saying he's an alcoholic as much as bad shit happens when he goes to the excess! Josh gets boozed up and KT takes advantage of him! She is a cruel author, abusing her characters that way. Shame on you KT! :).

JL23

He clearly needs to stop binge drinking. I'm not going as far as to say he has a problem with alcohol, as I don't think we've seen enough to say he drinks to excess on a regular basis. But clearly he cannot handle that much alcohol.

RCH

Josh needs to stop drinking! This all started in a post binge haze.

Pete

Speaking of coming full circle, this chapter does remind me of Book 1, Chapter 1. In that dream, or real, encounter with Devlin, it's claimed that Josh told Devlin of his fantasy of Kimmy sleeping with another man. So, as we near the end, it seems fitting that Josh has had a similar experience.

CSH

So what you Northern types are trying to explain is that Josh is not at fault for pissing himself. It’s the lack of adequate plumbing up there that caused him to get a waist level soaker in his own bed.

Andrew Mellein

From the past couple of chapters of Josh’s POV it seemed like he was open to leaving Kimmy even if the baby was his. I don’t think he wants to be used as chess piece by Kimmy anymore! We will see!

JL23

"Soon, Josh would have responsibility. They would start over. That is, if the worst things didn't happen. If they didn't, it opened the way for the best things to happen." Curious what everyone thinks Kimmy is referring to when she says "worst" and "best" things. To me, since she's talking about the baby, I think she's essentially conceding that Josh probably won't stay with her if the baby is Devlin's. If its his, he'll have responsibilities and he'll want to stay and raise the baby with her. In this chapter, she is back to thinking of and missing Josh. But again, it's more about the comfort he can provide, I don't get any sense she's modulating her thinking on how she wants their marriage to work going forward. Wonder if whatever happened to Josh changes her thinking on that.

Pete

I haven't watched Fallout yet. I was surprised how much I enjoyed the first two seasons of Halo.

L_S87

If you've played the games, it will make you giddy. If not, it's still very, very good, just won't have the emotional impact of seeing a T60 or Vertibird or 100 other things that made me geek out. Be prepared for lots of gore. It's very Fallout in that respect. Cooper definitely took the Bloody Mess perk.

L_S87

No, you're right, Bill. Her primary purpose with that video, I think, is Devlin's downfall with the secondary purpose of perhaps using it to excite Josh's kink. That said, her inner monologue from last chapter shows a deep desire for Josh to want what Devlin wants because that would be a glorious ending for Kimmy, in her mind. It's a fantasy. A deep desire, but not one I think she would actively pursue unless Josh provided indication he was turned on by it. She secretly hopes for that, but hasn't planned for it because Josh has outwardly indicated no desire for such a thing. Call it a plan b that would definitely be plan a if she thought it would work. But she knows it won't, so it's merely an erotic dream. Her true plans remain unchanged. Well, up till this chapter. Josh's new issues may wreak havoc on her plans.

Bill F Protagoras

I was gonna watch Fallout next.

Bill F Protagoras

It is my understanding that the video is not her message to Josh about his future, but a project to deceive Devlin, allowing Josh to share in her vengeance on her boss. If it is not she really is Bat Shit Crazy... and much more disturbed than I imagined. If she persists in objectivising people she loves, I don't see a bright future ahead of her. I have always defended her as a victim, and her right to fuck who she wants, but I wouldn't be happy with her caring for a child.

L_S87

I was interested in this, definitely will have to watch it now with your recommendation. Right now Fallout holds that spot for me, but I'm very VERY biased in that regard.

Bill F Protagoras

If Kimmy only thinks she might be responsible for Josh 'attempting' suicide I am sure the impact will be great. Lets hope it doesn't aggravate her thinking that suicide is further evidence of his 'cowardice'! If she just thinks she came close to losing him forever, who knows how she will react ?

Andrew Mellein

Hopefully Tai-Pan next? Read an interview I think the Hollywood Reporter. Where the showrunner Justin Marks is reading the book. I want them to adapt the entire Asian Saga!

Bill F Protagoras

Well, Andrew the new Shogun is now ranked with my top TV Series ever. Rivalling the very best! Shogun... a sublime ending within an end... subverting conclusion... a keen edged blade that is never seen fully unsheathed... soooo fucking good! "His soul shalt taste the sadness of her might, And be among her cloudy trophies hung."

Bill F Protagoras

Well said Mike!

L_S87

I wonder how this is going to effect Kimmy. I was very focused on what this meant for Josh, going down a very dark hole on how awful I thought the implications of this chapter would be. But I didn't really consider what this means for Kimmy, beyond the obvious if Josh was dead. Since he's not, what impact, if any, will this have on her? I accused her last chapter of not knowing moderation if it bit her in the ass. Maybe this is a big enough bite? The thought of losing Josh, not just maritally, but physically, how profound an impact will that have on her? We saw what losing their unborn child meant, what that did to her. What it instigated. If Josh was really close to dying, what sort of changes might this have to Kimmy's perception of the "perfect" outcome? Is it still Josh being a house husband she goes home to every night, sometimes with Devlin in tow so she can feed her darkness with Josh's pain while fucking Devlin? Or would she temper that because Josh's health becomes more important than her addiction to deviltry? I know what I hope for. Just not sure Kimmy has it in her to be that person, now. If Josh is "okay", is this merely a passing worry, swept under the rug for more immediate desires once the emotional trauma wears off.

NJ10

I see KT picked up on your desire for Josh to bed Karina. Although trust her to throw a spanner in the works with the bed wetting 😂

Bill F Protagoras

I think it is natural to have a beat or syncopation between chapters or sections of writing. Especially when you want to encourage the reader to linger or carry on... just as is done visually with comic pages. Or other media. We tend to say cliff hanger even when the pause or beat has much more subtle meanings or rhetorical connotations. You... KT Morrison lovingly labour to create inimitable works to satisfy the most discriminating readers. There are lots of people who write mediocre knee jerk hack work or even worse. But any people who impugn your literary integrity and painstaking work ethic are small minded, ignorant, spiteful, mean-spirited philistines who don't know their arse from their elbow... and give trolls a bad name. They buy books by weight as though they are sausages, not for the special worth a mind such as yours imbues the writing with! They wouldn't recognise originality, if it bit them!

L_S87

After reading all the comments here, your intent about Josh's peril, but that this didn't necessarily mean "The End" became a lot more clear. I failed to follow my own advice of being patient before posting because this Patreon format doesn't always allow us to read the story as intended. Thats great for discussion between chapters, but also, to your other point, means some chapters feel like cliffhangers even though they aren't intended to be. Your writing has never been gimmicky. Read plenty of that in haremlit. That's not you. Never will be. But I can already see where if I had read something like Maggie in this format, i would have had a totally different take on a number of chapters because I had to wait instead of saying "WTF!"... and then just turn the electronic page to get more context a few seconds later. I appreciate you taking the time to talk to us about this. Means a lot. Also validates why being subscribed will always be the right choice.

Bill F Protagoras

So more specific than the visual captured. A picture may be worth a thousand words, but sometimes a chosen few will do the job! Although I do believe the character was wringing out a sock as he complained about his soaker! Very Chaplinesque...

KT Morrison

It's when you step in a puddle and your shoe is completely wet, and there's water in the shoe, ha ha!

Bill F Protagoras

It's when you get splashed in, or by a puddle of water, I saw it in at least one episode of Murdoch Mysteries... which I watched sometimes while waiting for a new chapter of DITW.

CSH

And now you are going to tell us what it is, right? We are waiting…..

Mike Monroe

Ditto KT . Love your writing it really draws you in with the characters. I sometimes live and die with them . Josh is a favorite of mine. I am always a fan of the underdog or the perceived underdog in this story . KT keep on doing you. Love your work!!

KT Morrison

Soetimes it might seem I might write on beats, but I assure you that when I write as KT I', writing closest to my heart and avoiding commercial sensiblities to seek truth over dollars.

KT Morrison

No, no worries at all L_S87, I wanted you to think in many ways that Josh was in peril (although, I guess he still is). But I do write in terms of page-turning, not serial writing, so I don;t intend for you to wait until tomorrow to find out Josh is alive and well. I intend for you to start the next chapter! While this chpater break might seem extreme I don;t want anyone to think I'm resorting to gimmicks, or somesuch!

KT Morrison

I wish I had thought of this!

L_S87

Thank you, KT. Your writing is special. You make characters that we, or at least i, feel connected to on a deeper level than any other author I've ever read. It's a blessing every time you drop a chapter, because I know I'm in for something unique, and I'll know my beloved (or reviled for some of them) characters just a little bit better. Over the period of a series like this, we know them so well, or think we do, that they become like family members. We feel what they feel. The hurt, the love, the despair, the triumph. All of it. And with that comes good, and bad, reactions. For me. In this case, my love of Josh, who he is, and what he represents came to a precipitous stop. Or that's how my mind interpreted it. And boy did I not like that. Bad reactions and thoughts all over the place. Willing my fingers to type my nascent thoughts before they had time to simmer and develop into something more cognizant. Thankfully others here, like Glaucon saw it better than I did. You keep doing you, KT. I put my foot in my mouth because your writing makes me care that much. Your writing is that amazing and heart felt. It feels like a poor excuse to give on how your writing can evoke such reactions sometimes, but your books mean so much more than just the sum of words and thoughts they may superficially appear to be. The only unforgivable thing you could ever do is to stop writing. Don't ever do that. Thank you. Truly.

KT Morrison

Thank you so much.

KT Morrison

Yes!

KT Morrison

Thank you, Donkatsu! In my notebook I wrote: full circle for this moment.

KT Morrison

I once used the phrase “soaker” and had an editor say what the heck is that. Kat and some of the other Canadians will know…

KT Morrison

I think it is short for bunkhouse

KT Morrison

For those worrying: Josh has not killed himself! This is a page turner not a cliffhanger, so I don’t think it’s a spoiler to say I think Glaucon is closest to what has happened. You will see Josh again next chapter.

Bill F Protagoras

I presumed it was short for bunkhouse...

Bill F Protagoras

Josh closed his eyes while walking barefoot and hung over along a pier, the water in the lake must be very cold. If he fell in it wouldn't be good for him... Also when Hyun said it was Josh, she could mean on the line, which is why I thought the call could be about Meyer...

Kat

It’s like a tiny house without a bathroom and kitchen. A mini cabin.

L_S87

Like the others, I don't really think this is likely, but it would be humorous if Josh's fears were really just a drunken nightmare where he dreamed about waking up and thinking those things and Hyun's fear is Kimmy going ballistic. Especially if the photo was a drunk post of Karina and Josh in bed together, sleeping it off. That would certainly be a lot lighter than what I initially thought. Most likely were somewhere in between those two extremes.

L_S87

My opinion, but there's a lot of unknown here. Kimmy could have turned her phone off, so she never got a call or text. They could be avoiding her because they know how sideways Josh is with her (especially believable if Josh divulged "everything"). It could also be that things are hectic and a quick text was the easiest way to get the info out. But there's also merit in pointing out that if it was horribly serious, it wouldn't have been a text. It could be something like "Josh almost drowned, don't worry, he's alive, on our way to hospital." Ultimately we'll have to wait, as per usual. I was myopically focused on what felt obvious, but the reality is there are a ton of different options on what could have happened.

Bill F Protagoras

I'm also worried about Meyer...

L_S87

You're right, Glaucon. I initially read that and focused so hard on his unhealthy and dark thoughts of how humiliating and awful this situation was, with the confession he thinks he made just the cherry on top of this shit show, that I pretty much assumed his comments were hyperbolic of a knowing choice to keep walking right to the end of everything, both figuratively and real. Now I can see where that could be construed as hungover or still drunk delirium where he's so sure his nightmare of others finding out his shame is so real that he focused inward hard enough to lose, literally, sight of where he was at and accidentally walked in. His mental and physical state being so awful he was in no position to save himself, passed out, and would require intervention to stop him from drowning. If Josh is somewhere like the hospital, I think a number of our questions on what was actually said will be answered merely based on how the others treat Kimmy when she shows up. As much as I dislike some of what Hyun has done the last few chapters in relation to speaking about Josh, I worry how this may affect her, especially if she shows up with Kimmy, Kimmy gets treated like shit and Hyun makes a misguided attempt to defend her, thus creating quite the fiasco.

Bill F Protagoras

My first thought was some kindly soul was calling to snitch that Josh had outed Kimmy as a cheating cuckolding whore... but it seemed a bit unlikely.

JL23

Ha! No! A bunkie is a pre-fabricated detached extension to a cottage apparently popular in Canada and some parts of the US (Min-a-so-tah I'm guessing). Minnesota is really just Canada junior. They like their lake cottages, getting rip roaring drunk at them, they like hockey, and they talk funny. You guys should just take over everything north of Minneapolis. We'd never notice, or care. I kid cause I care.

CSH

Yep. Also vote for this one!

CSH

Wait, so he doesn’t mean a bunk bed?

CSH

Fair enough.

L_S87

Thank you for the reminder KT. Very, very much. On the surface this chapter hit me in the gut. Hard. And I got rather trigger happy with my posts. JL (I think?) Said this evoked a visceral reaction. And he's right. Thats what I got. Sorry if anything I said was out of line. I love your writing because it brings this kind of a reaction out, at least in me. But its a bit of a curse when I get so wrapped up and quickly post without digesting it first. I want the next chapter, badly!

JL23

Ha! I like that one! Maybe Hyun was checking the Gram (that's what the kids call it right) and saw Meyer posted a photo of Josh canoodling with Karina. Unfortunately, I don't think that would cause Hyun to have that reaction, but it's a fun thought!

Mike Monroe

I would just suck if Josh had died because of all the BS Kimmy has done...If he tried to kill himself that really would be a very weak move! No is one is worth your life especially in this type of circumstances. No having Kimmy in his life is not world ending. I am not sure that I like the turn in this story.. I will ..like others wait and see.

Andrew Mellein

I bet Josh isn’t in the hospital like everybody thinks. And Meyer posted an image online of Josh partying with Karina. And Kimmy gets insanely jealous!

JL23

On a much lighter note, I had to do a Canadian to American translation of what a "bunkie" was. I don't exactly come from an area where you'd have a cottage, maybe it's a thing here, but honestly thought he meant a bunk bed when he said it.

Donkatsu

Isn't this chapter the bookend to Tiffany's party? Josh, who should definitely not drink, has a hazy and probably wildly inaccurate idea about what went on after the lights went out in his brain. Josh is very likely not dead. In Cherry Blossoms the fate of Nia was somewhat ambiguous in that regard, and KT may think of these northern lakeside cottages as ideal places to off some of her characters. We need to focus on the real hanging chads: who's the daddy? how will Kimmy escape from legal sanction and financial ruin? will Josh take her back? How does Kimmy explain Hyun? KT has a lot of work left, she is entitled to have a little fun with us over the fate of Josh.

CSH

If he killed himself it’s all over so i doubt that. Though when KT decides to have her main characters reconcile they do sometimes end up tragically killed off. Could be any number of things. Could be a video of josh spilling the beans and humiliating himself. Could be no-one saw him and he has disappeared temporarily. I don't think he's dead, just kind of wishing he was. At least this time he had witnesses he can trust who might tell him what he really did or did not say. Given he has these blackout incidents when he drinks, best he not drink no more. Maybe Kimmy comes to his rescue in the hospital and they reconcile. Hard to say. A lot of this has strayed from what i considered the core story. I loved it as an erotic story but it seems to have wandered away from that and keeps threatening to get really tragic. Even Josh openly telling everyone about Kimmy and Devlin is kind of ball shrivellingly uncomfortable in my opinion. Not to mention possible suicide. So much for Kimmys cocky assed plan.

Andrew Mellein

It was never shown that Josh actually went into the water. So there must be something more here.

JL23

For me, suicide, or acting on suicidal thoughts, takes it up to a whole other level of darkness. But I should hold off judgment until I read and understand the entire context of the story being told here.

Bill F Protagoras

What I wrote is purely descriptive... Of course, it's not a cliff hanger, but for Kimmy it's one of those moments of unexpected alarm. It's a credit to your work that there's so much reaction. I was thinking about a comment by somebody on the previous instalment about what it's like to read a book that's in the process of creation , I agreed with what was said. But on reflection I realized it's in the nature of books we enter and leave them, when we can and when we must. Where was GRR when he finished A Dance with Dragons to reassure us that his next two volumes will be of a different quality from the last two seasons of the series and not to hold our breaths because of all the cliff hangers... Thank you, but all we have to do is have a little patience. It wasn't until Hyun answered the phone that I gave a second thought to Josh except about how different the two Waters' days are going. Not to be too callous, but if I must now convert the " walking into glorious oblivion" from an amusing hangover observation into Josh's actual last thoughts it's going to sound a bit cheesy, after the restrained prose of the denouement of Cherry Blossoms... I trust you. Your previous work has earned that trust.

Glaucon

I think we've been deep in the darkness on this one for a while now. It's why I've been calling it more of an erotic horror really, in a lot of ways.

JL23

Totally possible. Just the more I think about it, Josh even attempting to kill himself feels a bit too dark for this story about "darkness." If that even makes sense, I don't even know. Just feels like that is a topic very difficult to handle properly in a cuckold thriller, entertainment type story.

Glaucon

I think there's a good chance it'll be ambiguous as to whether it was an attempt. Like, he was drunk and he fell in and he'll deny it was an attempt but everyone will have that small part of them forever believing it was. It would line up with the continued torture/punishment/humiliation of Josh.

JL23

It just feels like it has to be something other than what all our visceral reaction was. Even if he tried to kill himself and survived, that seemingly takes this story down a much different path than a cuckold story. Not saying there wouldn't still be a story, but I just find it hard to deal with all of that within this story.

Glaucon

Next new book I'm going to see if I can wait for the whole thing to be finished first before reading. BUT HAVE I GOT THE WILLPOWER?

Glaucon

We're getting real deep in the weeds on a matter of etiquette here lol BUT if Meyer's on site as Josh's family, and Josh is alive and not suffering any real injury, I could see it as a quick hurried text/update or similar while Meyer is focusing on Josh. Especially if it happened at say 3am far away from the text recipient.

JL23

Perhaps, but news of a serious injury or worse would merit an actual call no? Maybe I'm living in the 90's still, but that doesn't feel like news you deliver via text.

Glaucon

Hyun got a text. Has Kimmy checked her phone? She might've gotten one too. I think "wet with fear" leans to something serious having happened to Josh.

JL23

Point taken. It just hit me as a shock, though unitended. The perils of reading chapter by chapter, I should keep that in mind.

JL23

Now that the shock wore off, I can parse through a few things. Hyun's reaction indicates it's bad, but also, why did she get the notice and not Kimmy. If Josh was seriously hurt (or worse), wouldn't Kimmy get the call? So, maybe it's something else about Josh. Not that something happened to him, but maybe things he told others about a certain person is now getting back to Hyun through Meyer, or someone else who was there.

L_S87

Like you, JL, I'm hoping Glaucon is right. My initial post was very much a knee jerk, visceral reaction to this chapter. Which is I hate it. Now, that's not necessarily a bad thing when you immediately have another chapter afterwards to provide context and talk you off the proverbial cliff. We don't have that here, so the mind churns and churns. Ultimately, you're right in that it wouldn't, probably, make much sense for this to be "the end" as it's a hard stop that goes nowhere. Well, not really, but you'll only have an epilogues worth of material because there's no making up, no change, no happiness, only sorrow and despair. Because we've literally lost 50% of the narration and story with Josh gone. The more I think on it, the more I agree it makes more sense that this isn't permanent, but definitely has permanent consequences for all involved. If there is one bright point for Josh, assuming he survived this, it's that no one (also assuming he said the things he thinks he did) would ever confuse that as anything but a drunken ramble not indicative of his true feelings if reliving those memories made him want to end it rather than face them all and go on. It shows just how awful his experience was. They'll pity him, which is it's own form of torture, but they'll never assume he's some twisted person not deserving of their association.

JL23

Yeah, I get the point and saw the KT comment, and what others said. This probably just isn't the best way to read a story like this. It's not meant to be a cliff hanger, but in this particular way of reading it inadvertently became one for us.

Glaucon

JL I miss reading KT books as complete stories dropped all at once so much

Bill F Protagoras

It's strange shock should feel so deathly still and undemonstrative.

KT Morrison

Just want to remind everyone, for the average reader this isn't a cliffhanger, it's only a page-turner. I didn't write this as a cliffhanger.

JL23

Again, I hope your scenario is correct (and think it is.) I don't think there's much more of a story if Josh is dead. It's more likely something else. I'd say this punishes Kimmy plenty in her own head, if she believes her actions drove him to try to take his own life. And if he told them, she'll also believe everyone there will think that as well. But I also agree L_S87, I don't love this turn (or this cliffhanger), no matter what it actually is. It hits on real life stuff, real life tragedies, I get it. Unfortunately, this happens all the time in real life. But, I don't love it being used as a cliffhanger (the perils of reading chapter by chapter, as someone mentioned in the comments last chapter) and I don't really know where we go with it from here. Either Josh just tried to kill himself (and maybe succeeded), or accidentally walked off a pier and died, and we have that darkness sucking any ounce of enjoyment left. Or it's some kind of misunderstanding, which makes a reader (at least this reader) feel a bit like Josh, used and manipulated.

Glaucon

KT wants to conjure the worst possibility in the reader’s mind here. Everything else aside, given the trauma and pain that Josh has gone through, and all the betrayals and manipulations of his very perception of his circumstances, it’s a realistic possibility for his story to end in a suicide. I don’t personally think that’s what’s happened. I think we’re going to find him in a hospital or something next. But whatever happens, KT wants the reader to understand what COULD have happened as a logical consequence of the events up to this point. And, presumably, for Kimmy to understand that too.

Bill F Protagoras

That awful lurch in perception like a body had stumbled up against your mind and dislocated it in space and time... with the simple utterance of "It's" followed by a name.

L_S87

I'm really hoping you're right, JL. Taking this at face value just guts the story for me. Ruins it. Not that this couldn't happen, it just doesn't feel like it would have given the lead up. So you've got to be right. Right? Josh has a nightmare about his world ending by telling his friends this horrible truth and thinks it's real, so he takes that long walk off a short pier. I'm hoping Karina or someone saw him and grabbed him before it was too late.

L_S87

Yes, Glaucon, you're right about the punishment. Which is why this feels so weird and awful to me. Poorly contrived. The only way it makes sense is that I'm making bad assumptions thinking this is what actually happened. To your other to point, we only have Josh's odd, disjointed PoV. I'm probably putting too much trust in that being 100% accurate. I'm hoping it's not, because I greatly dislike this turn if it is. Like I said before, it feels weird that he wouldn't be drunk enough to say that stuff, wake up being massively hung over, remember nothing *but* that he divulged "everything". That feels so off that maybe it's meant to be a clue that what Josh is recounting is not fact but a fictional nightmare conjured by his hung over mind and it leads him to do the unthinkable. As I said, I need to be patient and not jump to conclusions. Everytime Ive done so before, I've ended up with egg on my face for making bad assumptions and calling into question KTs choices. This just feels so real and final that I hate it.

Glaucon

I have a similar feeling JL but who knows!

Glaucon

I dunno it feels like this punishes Josh way more especially with the juxtaposition of their respective nights and mornings

Glaucon

I think it's very unlikely that Josh has died. How do two more books of this go without him? I'm thinking it more likely that they fished him out of the water and he's in the hospital or recuperating somewhere (and there can remain some ambiguity on whether it was an attempt or not). I also suspect that since we didn't see him sharing the truth with the party people that it might just be him misremembering, but that's just a guess. Anyway, lots of options to go and we will see.

L_S87

Maybe some timeline is missing that I'm not seeing? It feels odd that Quinn would ask that question, Josh would be nowhere near drunk enough to answer it given how he was acting last chapter... And yet somehow he does? Why? Very confused. It feels like this was a weird check box to set up a scenario to punish Kimmy. Going to have to follow my own advice from the last chapter and be patient and wait.

Andrew Mellein

I hope Josh didn’t take his life!

L_S87

To be honest, I don't care for this. Mostly because it feels awfully contrived. I'm praying what I think I read isn't what actually happened, but Hyun's reaction makes it pretty clear. And I don't like it because it honestly feels contradictory to the last 7 or 8 chapters of who Josh is. This is a weird 180 that, to me, makes no sense. Not to mention if he was drunk enough to spill all that to them and to piss the bed and have no idea how he got in bed with Karina, then how does he remember the rest?? We'll see. For me, it feels shoe horned in. A horror ending for a "horror" story. I hope very much that I'm wrong and this will end up something else. Josh in a hospital. A nightmare where he thought he said these things but didn't and it drove him to make a very big mistake that nearly cost him his life. And here I thought I wanted this chapter worse than any other chapter in the entire series, dreaded waiting. Now the next one is even more important because it will provide context sorely missing here.

JL23

I have a bad feeling Josh didn't actually tell anyone what happened at the party, or that if he did, they'd react in anywhere close to the way he was dreading. I'll choose to believe (hope) we're not going really dark with the rest of this story.

Bill F Protagoras

"She rested her hand on her tummy. Soon Josh would have responsibility. They would start over. Continue where they should have been in the spring."

Bill F Protagoras

"No words were spoken, but she knew right away that reality had shifted and something horrible had happened."

Bill F Protagoras

"There was a distinct absence in her heart, like something should be there and it wasn’t. She wasn’t whole. The strongest urge came over her to call Josh."

Bill F Protagoras

"How far would he have to travel to find release? He lifted his woozy head and closed his eyes, the mist on his cheeks, walking into glorious oblivion."

Bill F Protagoras

"He would be gone before anyone woke up. He would escape social death."

Bill F Protagoras

"The only moment for months where he’d felt human. Felt like he mattered."

Bill F Protagoras

"He needed air, that was all."

Bill F Protagoras

" He wished to blip out of existence. Anything that would ease this mortal pain."

JL23

Oh no, not a good cliffhanger. For once, not much to say. I hope this isn’t what it appears to be.

Bill F Protagoras

"The fucking horror of it all."


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